Does anyone know of a way to have both decimal and fractional dimensions in the same hole callout?fracdec.JPG


Categories: Drawings and Detailing

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Last comment By: Marcus Dimarco   Fri, 12 Jan 2018 22:47:47 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

You could set up your primary dimension to work in fractions and the  dual dimension to work with decimals. You'd just need to toggle the setting on the annotation to have it display the dual dimension afterwards.

 

The dual dimension settings are located in the drawing settings. To turn on the dual dimension, click on the annotation and go in the feature manager on the left and at the bottom there should be ''Dual dimensions'', tick the box and there you go.

By: Alex Lachance  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 16:02:35 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

What I need is the hole diameter to be decimal and the counter bore and counter bore depth to be fractional

By: Unspecified Unspecified  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 16:06:42 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Can't help you with that then, I don't think you can do it as you would have to be able to assign two different units to two linked dimensions that are inside one annotation. I know you can modify the annotation's units but I've never heard of modifying a part of an annotation's units.

 

Perhaps someone more advanced such as Deepak Gupta could answer this.

By: Alex Lachance  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 16:46:11 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

You may be able to use dual dimension and have call out displayed in both but I do not think you can have them the way you need without doing the manual typing.

By: Deepak Gupta  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:17:54 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Sorry John, modifying that file won't address the decimal/fractional display as far as I could tell when I looked into it.  And I looked into it extensively...That is unless something has changed since version 2014. 

By: Matt Peneguy  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:24:49 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

I'm curious why would you want mixed callouts? It's not standard.

By: Chris Saller  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:25:16 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Probably a shop's standard We have a bunch of these too, thankfully they are nothing too complex.

By: Alex Lachance  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:31:09 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Hello,

 

Yes, this is possible:

Select the callout and choose the particular element you're interested in fractionalizing (under "Callout value"):

Click the Other tab and select Feet & Inches, then fractions, then your denominator.

Repeat for the depth (mine is an odd depth and at 64 denominator, it did convert to a fractioni

When I updated the depth to .375:, here we are:

 

Cheers,

 

Kevin

 

EDIT: Add as a favorite so you don't have to repeat these steps.

By: Kevin Chandler  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:32:59 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Thanks Kevin!

By: Matt Peneguy  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:37:10 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

You're welcome.

Partial credit must go to Dan Pihlaja.

I had added an idea (Variable decimal precision for different Hole Callout components ) to the Top Ten and a few days ago, Mr. Pihlaja enlightened me on using the "Callout values" to change the individual precision of a callout's elements.

With this still fresh on my brain, I decided to give it a try for this post. And here we are.

 

Atta Dan Pihlaja!

 

Cheers,

 

Kevin

By: Kevin Chandler  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 17:46:36 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Thanks for the kudo's Kevin. 

By: Dan Pihlaja  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 18:03:24 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Kevin, Thanks. Are you using SW2018? When I highlight the hole callout, I don't get the "callout value" pulldown under "tolerance/precision. Maybe because I am using SW2017?

By: Unspecified Unspecified  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 18:18:50 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Chris Saller wrote:

 

I'm curious why would you want mixed callouts? It's not standard.

Chris  I have wanted to do this a few time because our CEO sometimes whats to specify a "Drill Size" rather than an exact decimal size.

The reason for this is that a drill will typically make a very slightly over-sized hole from the specified size.

If we specify "3/8" drill" the hole may actually be closer to .377 and not exactly round (the drill bit point is not always perfectly centered).

 

If we specify a ".375" hole the Machine shop will tend to use an undersized drill and then come back with a 3/8 drill and do a re-drill to produce a more precise hole. (or they may do it using an end mill and get it dead on).

If we don't care too much about the accuracy a simple one shot 3/8" drilled hole is cheaper then doing a drill / re-drill or using an end mill.

Not very common, but it has come up.

By: Rick McDonald  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 18:56:56 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

This is a very good point.  Sometimes you want accuracy, and are willing to pay for it.  But, why waste the money when you don't need to?  Details like this are important.  And I learned something new today!

By: Matt Peneguy  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 19:03:30 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Unspecified Unspecified wrote:

 

Kevin, Thanks. Are you using SW2018? When I highlight the hole callout, I don't get the "callout value" pulldown under "tolerance/precision. Maybe because I am using SW2017?

 

You won't see the "callout value" drop down if the hole is a mirrored hole (maybe...I have had mixed results) or an imported hole.

 

Or if it is a hole that is created by NOT using the hole wizard (I think that this includes the "advanced hole").

By: Dan Pihlaja  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 19:05:20 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Thanks. Do you specify both decimal and fractional tolerances somewhere?

By: Chris Saller  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 19:22:27 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

We do:

  1. 1 Dimensional Tolerances
    1. If not shown on the plans or specified elsewhere herein, dimensional tolerances for fabricated parts shall be as follows:
      1. Integers and Fractions:             ±0.03   inch
      2. X.XX”                                     ±0.01   inch
      3. X.XXX”                                  ±0.005 inch
      4. Angles:                                    ±0.5     degrees

 

It's been done that way since I started here almost 20 years ago.

I just notice that the hole depth and thread depth change together.  I'm not sure I'd ever want to specify them separately, but I just thought I'd mention that for people looking at this functionality:

When I change 1 field I get:

By: Matt Peneguy  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 19:34:00 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

fracdec2.JPG

By: Unspecified Unspecified  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 18:33:58 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Hello,

 

I'm 2017, sp1.

I click the callout and it's property manager opens.

Drop down the to select the value you want and go to the Other tab.

Don't what else to tell you.

 

Using Windows Snipping Tool, post an image of what yours looks like.

 

Cheers,

 

Kevin

By: Kevin Chandler  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 18:30:50 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Hello,

 

How is it created? Hole wizard?

 

BTW: To test's Dan's idea of a possible adv. hole, I created an Advanced hole in my sample drawing from above and SW doesn't let me make a callout for it.

Click Hole Callout, get the hole callout cursor, click the adv. hole in the view and the only thing that happens is the cursor is reset.

 

Can you upload your file?

Can you post an image showing the tree where this hole is constructed?

 

Cheers,

 

Kevin

 

EDIT:

Haven't looked into this and I don't use adv. hole (yet), so I just assumed a hole callout was the method of choice for these:

By: Kevin Chandler  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 21:10:30 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

I try this method often but it doesn't always work.  Most of the time it does not work for me on 2017.

You are just getting lucky because you do not choose "round to nearest fraction" so some of your decimal precision stay when you override to fractional.

By: Marcus Dimarco  Thu, 11 Jan 2018 21:07:29 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Thanks Kevin/Dan for sharing, never noticed that since there was never a need!!

By: Deepak Gupta  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 07:42:20 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Kevin Chandler wrote:

 

 

BTW: To test's Dan's idea of a possible adv. hole,

 

 

 

I meant that "advanced hole" doesn't work with hole callout.  I didn't mean to imply that it did work. 

 

Only hole wizard and simple holes will work with the hole callout (I have heard rumors that this might be changing in later SP's of SW 2018).

By: Dan Pihlaja  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 15:04:42 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Dan Pihlaja wrote:

 

Kevin Chandler wrote:

 

 

BTW: To test's Dan's idea of a possible adv. hole,

 

 

 

I meant that "advanced hole" doesn't work with hole callout. I didn't mean to imply that it did work.

 

Only hole wizard and simple holes will work with the hole callout (I have heard rumors that this might be changing in later SP's of SW 2018).

I created the hole in the picture below using advanced hole with 2018 SP1.0

As you can see it will work with the hole callout. The 7/16 depth was originally called out as .437. I was able to change it to 7/16 by using the other tab and clicking the Fractions radio button.

 

hole callout 3.png

 

the callout is hard to read because of the color when selected.

By: Tony Tieuli  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:14:59 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

That is a Color setting in the Tools/Options/Color

By: John Stoltzfus  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:19:48 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Tony,

This is good to know.  Advanced Hole in 2017 doesn't even propagate to the drawings.

By: Matt Peneguy  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:23:02 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Tony Tieuli wrote:

 

Dan Pihlaja wrote:

 

Kevin Chandler wrote:

 

 

BTW: To test's Dan's idea of a possible adv. hole,

 

 

 

I meant that "advanced hole" doesn't work with hole callout. I didn't mean to imply that it did work.

 

Only hole wizard and simple holes will work with the hole callout (I have heard rumors that this might be changing in later SP's of SW 2018).

I created the hole in the picture below using advanced hole with 2018 SP1.0

As you can see it will work with the hole callout. The 7/16 depth was originally called out as .437. I was able to change it to 7/16 by using the other tab and clicking the Fractions radio button.

 

hole callout 3.png

 

the callout is hard to read because of the color when selected.

 

Ahh, thanks for the confirmation!

By: Dan Pihlaja  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 16:27:29 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Chris Saller wrote:

 

Thanks. Do you specify both decimal and fractional tolerances somewhere?

 

We don't do it often but when we do it would be just for that hole (or a few holes) that uses a fractional drill size.

It comes up more when we get too busy for our own Machine shop to handle parts and have to make them on using outside shops.

Our machinists are trained on what we expect and if they are not sure we are right here to be questioned.

We also don't use GD&T, so it is partly to prevent outside shops from being over critical and over priced when they make the parts for us.

By: Rick McDonald  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 22:42:53 GMT
Re: decimal and fractional in the same hole callout

Well this method doesn't work; overriding to fractional changes everything in the callout to fractional, there is no way to specify which parts of the callout are fractional.  The reason this little picture seems to work is they did not click "round to nearest fraction" and they just got lucky that the callouts they wanted to remain decimal weren't exact fractions.

By: Marcus Dimarco  Fri, 12 Jan 2018 22:47:47 GMT
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